'Patriot Games' of the wrong kind

And he wasn't helped when his own surrogates, such as former Gen. Wesley Clark--who may have talked himself out of consideration for vice president or any other prominent post--started to make some sleights about McCain's experience in Vietnam. It was bad enough when Republicans made swift-boating a verb while challenging John Kerry. Surely no one will seriously try a version of that with McCain.

Please detail exactly what Clark said that was a "slight" to McCain's Vietnam experience. I would like the exact quote and the place or places where it was said.

Obama has that “new boyfriend” syndrome. Lots of excitement and he looked damn near perfect in those early days. You know, when you get to project on him all those traits you’re looking for beyond cute and smart - character, depth, humor, a moral center.

As time goes on, he’s no longer the shiny new thing. He disses your best friend (behind her back of course), you begin to see his smarminess when he sucks up to your boss and he just doesn’t fit in or get your family’s zany, noisy humor - and he’s stopped trying. The ultimate deal breaker - you learn that he’ll do or say anything to get what he wants.

You know the type - you’ve dated him or perhaps it’s your daughter or a good friend. He just never lived up to the promise of those first, early days.

Best to heed the advice you’ve given or gotten - Lose him quick and move on.

It would seem apparent to anyone paying attention, four-star General Wesley Clark was speaking on matters that concerned him. I don't think he was looking for a " job "in Senator Obama's cabinet, or administration. I have even more respect for General Clark, because, I believe, he knew that by stating the obvious about Senator McCain, he would be saying something controversial. What he said needed to be presented to the voting public, to our entire nation. I think , in commenting on the above article, I think General Clark was speaking about much more than Senator McCain's " experience in Vietnam ", he was speaking about Senator McCain's character !! Most of General Clark's comments concerned Senator McCain's lack of executive experience and his reliance on force to solve national problems. It was only when Mr. Schieffer, host of a Sunday morning talk show, mentioned Senator McCain's misfortune of being shot down in his plane in Vietnam, did General Clark, refer to his Vietnam experience. That reference was a one liner and to the point.
General Clark made some extremely cogent points, but like everything else that has to do with Senator McCain and some of the negatives in his record, some in the media, gloss over them and return the fire. What, has Corporate Media taken over, where the, not too, Swift-boaters, left off?? The hatchet job done on four star General Clark, sure looks as if they have!!?
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW.

Strange that it's Obama and his people who keep bringing up his "patriotism." Obviously, Obama thinks it is his Achilles' heel. Main reasons are the concern many have over his Muslim roots and the Islamic threat to world peace; his rather stupid disdaining of flag symbols early on and now wrapping himself in the flag; his 20-year preacher damning the U.S.; his association with anti-American terrorists Dohrn and Ayers, and his wife's voiced lack of pride in this country until her husband ran for president. We know the sacrifices McCain made for his country. We know of none that Obama has made. The media would like to deep-six the patriotism issue, but maybe they should advise their candidate Obama to quit bringing it up.

When the Founding Fathers declared their freedom from the British monarchy in 1776, they based their argument on the unalienable rights of equality and "LIFE, liberty and the pursuit of happiness"

We need to think about what that means.

From the scripture:

"What you do to the least of these you do unto me"
"Before I knit you in your mother's womb I knew
you".

Both the present Pope, the previous one, John Paul II and Mother Theresa said that abortion was the pre-eminent moral issue.
Without the right to life all other
rights have no meaning. That precious
infant in the mother's womb deserves a chance just like all of us.
Mr. McCain had an 89% pro-life voting record in the Senate .
Mr. Obama? 0%.
In addition to being our most pro-life
president ever, Mr. Bush spent more on social
welfare programs and combatting AIDs than any
previous chief executive. He appointed more
minoritiesto top positions in the
Federal government than anyone previously had.
He tried but failed to come up with some
kind of immigration reform.
More money was put into New Orlean for disater
recovery than anywhere else in the history of the country.
We've lost 4000 soldiers in Irag but progress
is being made. We lost 50,000 in Vietnam and left there with nothing really accomplished.
The present Pope, when he was a cardinal, said
that one could disagree over issues such as war and the death penalty and still be a good Catholic. Abortion and homosexuality are always
and forever more wrong and serious evils. They
were wrong two thousand years ago and will be
two thousand years from now.

I should qualify what I wrote about Mr Obama's
pro-life voting record in the Senate. He did
cast one pro-life vote (to save the life of Terri Schiavo). He now said he regrets doing that, however. So, de facto he does have a 0%.
By the way, when he was in the Illinois legislature he voted against requiring a physician to save the life of an infant who
had survived a botched abortion. This is a more extreme position than even most pro-abortion groups like NARAL have. He is as far as I know the most pro-abortion, pro homosexual candidate ever to run for president. If this man represents the new Christianity and the new America, God help us all.

This country did great things by getting rid of slavery and
segregation. But with abortion and homosexual marriage we have only
traded one set of evils for another.

Nothing sanctioned by man can have any validity or lasting if it is not also likewise sanctioned by God.

The reason that attacks on John Kerry's patriotism worked is because, unlike John McCain, when Kerry got home from Vietnam, he trashed his comrades... calling them "baby killers" and "rapists". And it's exactly why the unAmerican stink of Rev Wright will stick to Obama--because he sat in that America-hating church for 20 years.

Which face is Obama talking out of now.......?

You folks in the PRess continue to allow this empty suit windbag get away with it........There is no more ultimate act of Racism that not to treat him as you would anybody else running for office........Obama long ago learned how simple it is is to manipulate the white man.....he expects that all standards be lowered to accomodate his lack of lack of experience and his certain leftist views.

And you guys are doing his bid....do you not realize how difficult you are making it in the future for truly worthy and intelligent people of color?

Sad to see you really believe that people of color are inferior and need you to change the rules so we can succeed

Neither McCain or Bush understand military strategy. They don't seem to know much about Iraq either. It doesn't matter if we stay in Iraq for another day or a hundred years in the end the now dominant Iraqi Shia tribe and their government will be more allied with Iran than the USA. They share a religion and a whole lot of Maliki's government offcials were exiled in Tehren for decades while Saddam was in power.

They rolled out the red carpet in March for Iranian President Ahmadinejad while Bush, Cheney and the rest of our officials have sneak into the country.

We invaded, occupied and destroyed their country. We arrested them without charges, imprisoned them without trial and some of them we tortured. The War in Iraq has been a huge waste of time, money and lives.

Obama is right, let's get out of there and go get Bin Laden.

When Americans take a retrospective look at the unfathomable damage of having republicans running the show (expensive gas, high priced loaves of bread and food, devalued homes, billions spent on a war based on highly exaggerated claims, deteriorated public education, lost jobs, a faltering economy, a huge deficit, a lame duck president, I could go on), they won't give a spit about Obama's x-pastor or Wes Clarke's honest question of whether getting shot down in a fighter plane is adequate presidential resume material. It seems to me, most voters can hardly wait to vote for the Democrat.

Tackett writes:

"The distressing part of this is that Obama and McCain claim to be where they are in part because they were willing to take the high road and not engage in overtly personal attacks. So far, that is not what is happening."

This "plague on both your houses" approach is a tell-tale sign of lazy non-reporting. The personal attacks have come from Obama surrogates, not from McCain surrogates. So far, at least 7 Obama surrogates have gone after McCain's military service: George McGovern, Jay Rockefeller, Tom Harkin, Bill Gillespie, Ed Schultz, Tony McPeak and the military commander fired by President Clinton: Wesley Clark. Hard to believe this is just coincidence. It's a coordinated Obama campaign strategy.

Tackett cannot identify a single McCain surrogate attacking Obama's patriotism, mentioning the flag pin, claiming he's a Muslim, etc. But these attacks did come from Hilary Clinton supporters in the primaries.

And so far, only one candidate has questioned others' patriotism: Obama. He said, about wearing flag pins:

"[A]fter 9/11, particularly because as we're talking about the Iraq War, that became a substitute for I think true patriotism, which is speaking out on issue that are important to national security ..."

He basically called flag pin wearers mock-patriots in order to win over lefties in the primaries. And now that he's trying to win over Reagan Democrats in the general, Obama sports...a flag pin.

anyone trying to draw parallels with clinton wins in 1992 and 1996 over Bush Sr. and Bob Dole conveniently ignore the Ross Perot factor. Ross Perot took 18% of the vote in 1992 and 9% of the vote in 1996, mostly from the GOP candidates

Obama all CHANGE all the time (this list grows longer every day):

CHANGE ... what you'll have left after I raise taxes.
CHANGE ... your gas prices upwards, but gradually
CHANGE ... my hat size because every day my head gets bigger
CHANGE ... the national motto to: In Obama We Trust.
CHANGE ... what I do to my story depending upon whom I'm talking to.
CHANGE ... what I do every day to my foreign policy
CHANGE ... what I do to my trade policy depending upon whom I'm talking to
CHANGE ... your lifestyle because the rest of the world doesn't like you
CHANGE ... my friends when they turn out NOT to be "The person I knew"
CHANGE ... what my radical left-wing ideologue handlers have in store for you
CHANGE ... what I do to facts to suit my needs.
CHANGE ... my previous position in favor of gun control was 'inartful language'
CHANGE ... my pastor's screed is OK, yours isn't
CHANGE ... FISA line that we crossed but I have now moved back
CHANGE ... from public to private campaign financing because I can raise more money
CHANGE ... I'll debate John McCain anytime, anywhere; except when and where he asks me.
CHANGE ... the words of others and claim they're mine, because words count.
CHANGE ... the meaning of Bible verses to meet my own liberal world view
CHANGE ... more of you into victims of something and build government programs to take care of you
CHANGE ... you into a ward of the state so that I OWN you and your vote
CHANGE ... your mind and believe in me for I am the Obamessiah come to save you
CHANGE ... into giggling sycophants; liberal mainstream media do under the spell of the Obamessiah
CHANGE ... the chant I use to control the weak-minded Obamanized masses
CHANGE ... into an Obamatron; join the cult, repeat the chant: CHANGE, CHANGE, CHANGE ...
CHANGE ... what I plan to do to America because it's the greatest country on the planet.
CHANGE ... the national anthems of all the nations of the world to Kumbaya using my messianic foreign policy skills
CHANGE ... into mumble-mouthed idiot when I don't have prepared speech to read.
CHANGE ... historical facts to agree with my life story
CHANGE ... I said the DC gun ban was constitutional, but now I agree with Supreme Court ruling it unconstitutional.
CHANGE ... what I said because my rhetoric was 'overheated and amplified'
CHANGE ... I mocked Hillary during the primary, now she “rocks”.
CHANGE ... I respect McCain's service to his nation, so I sent Wesley “looser” Clark out to demean him
CHANGE ... but not for us, not the left-wing liberal elite, CHANGE is for YOU.
CHANGE ... the mortgage industry is a bunch of crooks; but I got my deal
CHANGE ... I was against welfare reform until Congress passed the Welfare Reform Act, then I “invented” it in Illinois
CHANGE ... I didn't vote to censure MoveOn.org for the “General Betray Us” ad, but now that I need some Independent votes, I'll issue a rebuke.
CHANGE ... I didn't wear an American flag pin because it was substitute for true patriotism, but I do now.
CHANGE ... I support our troops, but I'll take money from anti-military, anti-American Code Stink.
CHANGE ... when I'm president, I'll immediately bring the troops home ...
CAHNGE ... I want to bring the bring the troops home by March of 2008 ...
CHANGE ... I'll bring the troops home in sixteen months ...
CHANGE ... I'll begin to withdraw troops immediately, a division or two per month ...
CHANGE ... unless I “refine” my policies.
CHANGE ... anything and everything I've said or done in my life if it will help me win
CHANGE ... the definition of change to: What I say, when I say it, to whom I say it.
CHANGE ... I can CHANGE when it suits me
CHANGE ... you can believe in ... for a day or two
CHANGE ... you can't keep up with
CHANGE ... you can see through
CHANGE ... you can count on, daily ... or more often

CHANGE ... your underwear because you'll defecate in your pants when you wake up to find out what the left-wing liberal ideologues have done after gaining complete control of government.
CHANGE ... YOU better freaking BELIEVE IN because it will WORK YOU over.

Obama: the AUDACITY to count on you and I being DOPEs

HoBama, walkin' the streets for votes ... What do you wanna hear honey?

Catherine that's a cute little story you tell but it has no bearing on reality. Here's a little reality for you. John McCain's wife agonized for over five long years while he was a prisoner in Vietnam. She did her best to get him released and raise their kids. She was horribly injured in a car crash one Christmas Eve while he was gone.

When McCain came home he rewarded her loyalty by cheating on her and then he divorced her. As she said recently, "John didn't want to be 40, he wanted to be 25".

Some people have near death experiences or come out of POW camps with a changed attitude, a new purpose in life. John McCain apparently came back from Vietnam determined to make up for all the sex
he missed. With women other than his wife.

When it became politically expedient to find a new wife he settled on the Barbie doll daughter of a very well politically connected incredibly wealthy beer baron in Arizona.

It's been reported by at least three witnesses he called Cindy a "c*nt" in public. Until he decided to run for president again she was living with their daughter in San Diego, probably in the home she and John neglected to pay taxes on.

McCain's history is one of a mediocre Navy pilot, a less than serious playboy. His maverick political reputation stems from the fact that he has occasionally abandoned the Republican party's dumber positions for ones Americans actually support, like campaign finance and immigration reform. But in order to win over the the party base he's flip flopped on virtually everything he ever stood for.

On November 27th last year he even told Charlie Rose he rejected the Korea model he now clings to and said we're going to have to get out of Iraq sooner than later. He then went on to say we must pull our troops back to our bases and let Iraqis patrol their own streets. Somebody should tell him that was the pre-surge strategy he hated. He even voted against ending torture on March 1st. His tax proposals are crazier than Bush's as impossible as it seems.

He's grown from being the golden boy lady killer of his youth to a nation killer.
Any other pilot would have washed out of the Navy for crashing two planes and clipping power lines with another but not McCain. As the son and grandson admirals he was allowed to skate by and finished near the bottom of his class at Annapolis, 894 out of 899.

John McCain isn't someone you should give your phone number to let alone bring home to meet mom and dad. He's physically beyond making you just another notch on his belt but has moved on to other conquests.

He wants a do over for Vietnam in Iraq and maybe Iran. The American people aren't willing to let McCain try and redeem himself with our blood and treasure. We can't afford more of that stupidity after chickenhawks like Cheney and Bush have almost bankrupted us with the same.

Stop misleading people. First, the Obama supporter who allegedly questioned McCain's national security expertise was himself a General and, thus, in a pretty good position to comment on national security. Second, General Clark's actual quote in no way disparaged Sen. McCain. He merely pointed out that while Sen. McCain is a hero, he has never held an administrative position in the military. He has never, as a member of the military, had to make decisions that put troops in harm's way. Thus, his service, while admirable, isn’t necessarily the thing that makes him qualified to be President. Gen. Clark did not say Sen. McCain wasn’t qualified in many other ways. He spoke fact, not lies, exaggerations, or half truths! What ever happened to fair and balanced?

Clark is nothing but an attack dog for Hussein, who sold his four stars for 30 pieces of silver. It is really sad to see a four star General fall on his sword for a politician.

The question should be, What kind of judgment is BHO showing by attacking John MCCAIN'S service to his country?

All voters should ask themselves,"Who do you want in the oval office when the Generals enter the room and say, Mr President, Iran has launched a nuclear weapon at Israel, what do we do?

Hey Occam,

I've seen your "Change" post multiple times now. It is long, boring and simple-minded. Time to get a new gig.

I wondered where all of " the Senator Obama haters " were at and here I find them, bush-whacking him, in every way, lying can achieve. It's too bad they don't want to talk about the dishonesty of Senator " Questionable Conduct " McCain or his lobbyist compound, know as " The Reform Institute "!!
It is really a sorry state of affairs, when the best you can offer America, is cheap shots and lies about Senator Obama. Here I thought Senator McCain was an able candidate for our Presidency, but I see, his " shock and awe troops " aren't getting the job done. America is voting in Senator Obama as our next President and all of your lies, distortions and innuendoes, will not make your candidate any better, a candidate !!
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW.

Brian (at 12:32 pm) - I agree with your post - the paragraph where the author seems to make both candidates equivalent in smearing character, also caught my attention. It seems to me that most of the surrogate-based smearing is going on in one direction. It's not okay to say "everyone's doing it", becuase they're NOT. I see the same "moral equivalence" thing going on right now as Obama moves to center (i.e. changes from liberal positions he espoused during the primary to more palatable centrist positions). Shows have talked about how everyone does it, and they say McCain has also switched positions, but there's a big difference: Obama has taken the easy road - appearing to be the liberal to a liberal base, then making himself a centrist for the general election. If anything, McCain's recent moves (supporting bush tax cuts, offshore drilling, immigration, etc.) have been to move to the right to shore up his base, given he's basically a centrist already (obviously not on all issues). These centrist positions, where he has actually shown leadership, have been what have gotten McCain into trouble with Republicans.

Energy cost is the root of all evil. I want to know which candidate has a workable plan so I won't pay $20 per gallon of gasoline when I retire.

I notice that more than one post in this thread has the following tag: "SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW." Does that mean all 390,000 of them, posted in more than one hundred fifty countries? Great idea!

Gerj, Our great country doesn't only belong to christians. You need to deal with that fact.

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW....Posted by: Don Fitzgerald, Chicago | July 5, 2008 2:15 PM

----------------

Who do you think you're kidding? You're not supporting the troops...you're stabbing them in the back and aborting their mission.

But you're really following an old American tradition when the going gets tough: loyalists selling out the Revolution, Copperheads stabbing the Union in the back, isolationist Republicans doing in Wilson's effort for a just and lasting peace in Europe and then fighting Roosevelt's effort to keep Britain afloat under Hitler's onslaught.

If early setbacks and colossal blunders were a reason to quit fighting, all these wars would have been lost. And it is a myth that politics have ever stopped at the waterfront...you're just following a well trodden path.

This is not pertinent to the post, so if you wish to delete it, that's OK. But I do ask that you please pass it on to whoever handles technical matters for the Swamp blog.

The problem is this: When comments are published, they appear without paragraph breaks (or with really minimal ones.) That, in turn, causes the appearance of typical nutroots, emotionally inflamed run-on sentences, even when the actual content is reasonable.

So correct that if you please, resident techno-geek.

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW....Posted by: Don Fitzgerald, Chicago | July 5, 2008 2:15 PM

----------------

Who do you think you're kidding? You're not supporting the troops...you're stabbing them in the back and aborting their mission.

But you're really following an old American tradition when the going gets tough: loyalists selling out the Revolution, Copperheads stabbing the Union in the back, isolationist Republicans doing in Wilson's effort for a just and lasting peace in Europe and then fighting Roosevelt's effort to keep Britain afloat under Hitler's onslaught.

If early setbacks and colossal blunders were a reason to quit fighting, all these wars would have been lost. And it is a myth that politics have ever stopped at the waterfront...you're just following a well trodden path.

McCain = another counter-productive $ trillian war, this time in Iran.
Obama = get back to the original mission of destroying bin Ladin and Al Qaeda -- who aren't in and aren't supported by Iran, not withstanding McCain's apparent ongoing confusion.

Republicans are yet to come to terms with the egregious errors in implicit in the nomination of John McCain to compete with Obama in the fall general election. The errors will become self-evident the moment McCain starts to share common stage with Obama during the fall debates. It is going to be more than the future versus the past.
It is going to be more about vitality, vibrancy, exuberance etc versus spent-force, washed-out, colorless etc. It is not just about McCain’s age but his lack of communication skills and oral delivery.

On national security, McCain has huge problem with his position on Iraq. McCain has not addressed what he is meant by US win in Iraq and what form it is going to take. Surge has succeeded in partitioning Iraq into Sunnis, Shiites and Kurds. The challenge is how to form national government through self-determination rather than US-led imposition.

for the past two years the senate and house have been under Democrats. Since then taxes have gone up, gas prices have increased over $2.00 a gallon, food prices have increased, housing prices have taken a nose dive and the stock market has suffered. Don't blame this on president bush or john mccain.